An Attributer gone bad???

murphy · Senior Member

I sent Ken Potter some coins for examination & attribution in 2005 and it was over a year and a half later that it was learned that he misplaced them, then found them. He apologized, but the damage was done earlier when he had claimed they were sent back to me. I had no recollection of him sending my coins back and all the while he had them - he had lied whether he meant to or not. He was clearly overworked and there's no way I would trust my coins now to someone who is so heavily burdoned.

Ken is not the only ones that I have had "disappointments" with. I emailed a couple people about getting an FS number for the 2006P-1DO-017 major class-4 DDO. I got one reply that an FS number will not be given to this variety at this time, but may be assigned at a later date. The other email I sent went unanswered. But that's ok, because I am having what I consider great success selling these 017 varieties without their help.

Bob P · Site Admin

The saga, and the grievance is back on. Although Ken returned most of my coins, there were still 3 of them that were not returned. I emailed him on August 13th about that, but of course was ignored. I re-emailed him a couple of days ago, and threatened to re-file the grievance. I also provided the president of CONECA (Mike Diamond) with a copy of that email. Mike emailed Ken on my behalf, and Ken pretty much told him that I would have to wait my turn for him to find my coins. I guess 13 months isn't a long enough wait.
Anyway, Ken's attitude about this whole ordeal is pretty much that he doesn't fear a grievance. and he will do things on his own time line without being concerned about other people coins, feelings, or frustrations.
Based on Kens attitude, and failure in his duties as an attributer, I have re-filed the grievance through CONECA. I will let you know how it comes out.

VERY IMPORTANT!!! This case has nothing to do with CONECA, with the exception that Ken is a board member for them. His singular actions should NOT...I repeat should NOT affect any one's dealing with that fine organization. Mike Diamond has done everything in his power to try and bring this to a better solution. I applaud and thank Mike very much for all he has done for me, and I emphasize that there is no problem with that organization. Please support them like you support coppercoins.

Russellhome · Veteran Member

I'm glad to hear that some coins are finally being returned. Maybe there is still hope for me.

I have made only 1 submission to Ken Potter - a few SMS 2005 DDO nickels - way back in December of 2005. This was well before the Minnesota and Oregon 25c DV frenzy - when the only known Doubled Die in the 2005 nickels was the stronger Bison DDO. And, btw, the submission was at his request. Yes -he called me based on an eBay listing I had and asked me to send him some examples for an article he was working on. He included my name in a Jan 2006 article and mentioned some other new 5c varieties - but they never got listed and I never got my coins back.

I sent him a 1/2 dozen emails throughout 2006 asking about the status of my coins. I got a reply in February 2006 - saying he'd try to get to them 'this weekend'. In September, after a couple of ignored emails - I sent a more strongly worded email --not crude or profane -- just a direct message saying that I was not pleased with his operation and that I wanted my coins back, examined or not'. To that, I got my 2nd (and last) reply on the matter...

Gabe · Senior Member

Russellhome.. I had the same experience with Mr. Potter. I have given up trying to email him, and will begin a formal complaint with CONECA and other organizations.

For being so backed-up, Potter sure has time to manage his ebay auctions and listing.

Like you said, I'm never sending anything to him again. I'm just glad I didn't have to go through this situation when I sent him my 2004 DDO nickel back when I discovered it. I would have been very mad if that would have happened to me with that coin!

smed · Senior Member

Gabe · Senior Member

Russellhome · Veteran Member

Bob P · Site Admin

As an attributer for coppercoins, I am small change (excuse the pun) compared to Ken Potter. I really do believe that the last year or two got totally out of control for him, and either he didn't see it coming, or failed to do something about it when it was happening. He, at any time, could have announced that we needed to hold off on sending other coins until he got caught up. His computer messed up, he was sick, he still needs to earn a living are all acceptable excuses. However, because he never admitted to himself that he wouldn't catch up, he let it go until it snowballed out of control. When he used to return emails, he did set approximate time frames when the coins would be returned. Invariably, that never worked for him. Now...he is so pissed off at all of us, and his attitude has gotten so bad, that the hole he dug is simply getting deeper.
Do I feel sorry for him?? To a certain extent, I do because I know first hand how an attributer feels when he can not abide by a time frame he may have promised. We feel badly when that happens, but not communicating that to the customer is where Ken made his big mistake. Not scheduling his attributions is probably another mistake.
Anyway folks, the grievance I filed with CONECA should he finished by some time next week. I will let you know the results.

Bob P · Site Admin

Well, I told you I would let you know how the grievance is going. It seems that CONECA has decided that MORE time is necessary. They sent Mr. Potter a letter stating that he had until the 31st of October to return my coins or 'action will be taken'. In other words, they gave him an additional 6 weeks to handle it. I am not real happy with the way the grievance is being handled, and I have been instructed not to contact anyone on the committee until this has run its course. I will do as they request but the bottom line is that no matter how hard you fight for what is right, there is always someone on the other end just waiting to bring you down again. I believe that this may be the first grievance that CONECA has been faced with. Therefore, the committee may not be aware of the process or time limits. I will give them a fair enough chance to see what they can do. Those of you waiting to see what happens on this one will unfortunately have to wait longer. I guess 13 months wasn't long enough in my case...so what's 14 1/2 months?

GarryN · Expert Member

I see a little "old boy network" at work here.

Earwig · Veteran Member

It doesnt surprise me at all. I have noticed that within CONECA there are certain people who get treated better then others. Some people send a coin in and it comes back to minor then another sends the same coin in and its is attributed. (This was an experment done a few years back). And if they took action wouldnt they need to find another person to attribute there world varieties. Also I see he had time to write an article that was published on sept 23 2007 for them (wonder how long that coin sat around). I hope everyone gets there coins back and it all turns out good but it wouldnt surprise me if it took another year. Winter is coming and there will be a local coin show in the greater detroit area almost every sat and sun. I bet i will see him at the ones that I attend. I feel fortunate to have never had dealings with Mr Potter and now never would think of it.

Eric

Dick · Expert Member

Bob, and all others, I have been "busy" in other areas, (including finding out I am "legally blind", and can't drive my car anymore), but that is just another problem ". The case at hand with K.P. is something that should have NEVER happened! If Mr. Potter had jusr admitteed to himself, that he can't keep up, and had the foresight to advise ALL, that no more submissions be sent until further notice, ( loss of the fee$, etc), and that he could get caught up, but that didn't happen. Now the Excrement has hit the fan! I suspect that there is more than what meets the eye. As the saying goes, "this is just the tip of the iceberg"! How many others have sent coins, and after a long wait, have forgotten about them, and/or decided that they "were too minor" to be considered, (but NOT RETURNED)??? Ken could learn a LOT from Bob!
Dick

Bob P · Site Admin

Dick,
You are absolutely correct in that this goes MUCH deeper than appears on the surface. There are so many folks out there in the same situation, and Ken is supposed to be sending their coins back, but he hasn't quite kept up with that. My plight is visible because I made it that way. Too many folks haven't said anything because they are either embarrassed, or just kissed their coins goodbye. Not me. I thought by filing this grievance that I would get some quick help to end this saga, but even the CONECA grievance committee thought that another 6 weeks was warranted for him to comply. How simple is it to put 3 of my coins (which I was told he knows where they are) in an envelope and mail it to me? Seems nothing is simple any more, and Mr. Potter is getting away with it, and is probably laughing at us. He doesn't care about us, or our property. That has pretty much been evident for almost 2 years now for some folks. This is theft in my book. Fees had been paid, and he failed to return the goods. It is really sad, and in an attempt to get it fixed, all I have manged to do is extend the fiasco. This is one case where the CONECA grievance process has failed in the short term. Maybe in the long term, everything will work out. However, since I have been prohibited from contacting anyone on the grievance committee, I will not know anything until the end of the month. After that, if I still don't get my coins back, it might take CONECA another 6 weeks to take some sort of unknown action, which still may lead to nothing. Frustration is getting pretty close to critical here. Don't know how much longer I can take the run-around.

Dick · Expert Member

Bob, my friend, don't give up the ship! Just when one thinks things can't get any worse, you know what hits the fan!
Think of it as the story avout the young bull, and the old bull, grazing out in the pasture, when they noticed a herd of cows, way out, under some trees. The young bull said, "lest run out there and mount one of those cows"! The old bull saud, "No, lets WALK out there, and mount ALL of them"!
Dick

GarryN · Expert Member

Maybe the dude has some medical issues that prevent him from working.