Altered Error

[coop]

While searching this evening I found what looked like an unplated Cent. But on closer obversation I noticed a plated area near damage on the planchet. So this coin was plated and then made to look unplated. How? Not sure, but when you find it in change, face value is all it is worth.

[eagames]

Coop,

Here's one I'm not sure about.
It has flow lines on the rev & obv and some streaks. It has specks of copper if you look at the bottom picture.

I think even real ones might have some copper from particles on the die transfered to it or on the unplated plan.

This one was in a tubed roll, the others were normal but I'd suspect whoever put it in the tube would have seen it. I suspect it was a science project alteration but still I couldn't reproduce it and expect acid would have left some signs so it's a puzzler!

I wasn't convinced enough that it's real to send it for grading, what do you think? Real or science project?

[Dick]

Coop, do you have any friends that work in the Mining, and Refining Industry? The reagents used in the refining, and milling part of the recovery will dissolve the copper, (among other metals). The "CONS",(concentrates) are then filtered , then sent to the refinery for "sepAration". That is until they brought in the "acid Bath", (Sulpheric Acid), '46/'47. They used 500,000 ton bins that were flooded with the acid. Then it was collected in ponds, and became known as "pregnant solution". This later was pumped into large concrete tanks, filled with scrap tin cans to precipitate the copper from the "pregnant solution", as it was called. Been a lot of years since I worked there, and the procedure may not be in the proper secquence. I'm sure ASARCO won't mind my slight error. The "Operations" crew used to do lots of "nasty little things like that. Maybe still do. I know that they did get "real upset" when laundry detergent "accidently" is introduced into the slurry!
Dick
For you "Knit-pickers", I was out for 12 months, and 25 days, and then went back on active duty, from the reserves. With a "minority cruise", (3yrs, 2 mo. and 5 days), early ship=over, up to three months early, I still retired with 19yrs, 7 mo., and 5 days. Fully retired 1972.
Dick

[coop]

Seems like there would be more zinc errosion if these coins were real. I feel the copper plating was there, but was plated over with something else, probably Zinc. Just have figured out what to remove the zinc to see the copper below. I remember some one in ebay selling a recipe on how to make these gray Cents. So I don't put much faith in any of them.

[eagames]

Coop,

The one in my pics it looks like the copper was removed if it was there in the first place. I'm guessing some are done with acid but maybe not this one. It looks like it either was missing on the plan or peeled of later. Maybe they shock it thermaly and the differances in the thermal expansion/contraction helps it delaminate then they peel them off.

I've read that soaking in bleach will eventualy take copper off but not hurt the zinc but I tested after a day saw no change.

I've seen that if a cent gets in the washing machine for a few cycles the plating along the edges gets removed so they look like they have a silver colored rim.

You're right that most of these missing plating "errors" being found or that you see on ebay are fakes.

I've seen ones graded by the top 3 graders as plating errors so I assume some must be real.
Does anyone have a good pic of a graded one?

[Dick]

The only "plating errors", I've seen, listed, are on the ststes issues, and several of them have come out with a dull gray finish, or in other cases, have only a partial plating.
LATER:
It just occurred to me, why not weigh those coins that are doubtful? If they are zinc, and are "legit", they should weigh 2,5gms.+/_ a hair
Dick

[eagames]

What I'd like to see is a close up of the surface of one like this that was graded by one of the big 3 "credible" graders like this one to see how the surface looks to see if it has any bits of copper and how it looks. But I've never seen one in hand and can't afford to buy one just to look.

Hmmmm from the pics it does looks similar to the one in my pics! Maybe I should get it out of my spending pile and not spend it after all


http://cgi.ebay.com/1983-Cent-on-Unplated-Planchet-Mint-Error-NGC-MS-65_W0QQitemZ280059034521QQihZ018QQcategoryZ524QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

[coop]

Ed: The one I found looks like acid had been used on it. The coin that you found looks like it has something on it. But note the one in the auction, it looks like it has very smooth fields. Probably what a real one should look like. A little pricey, but I'd rather have a nice DDO like a 84 Double Ear or a DDR 83 for about the same money. But that is just my cup of tea and not everyones.

[eagames]

I looked at mine and can see it has no coating but it lacks detail and the remaining flakes of copper fall off easily, I'm almost sure that somehow it was peeled off and I bet there's a way people get it to lift, like temperature then it loosens up and they peel it.

Yes! Total agreement on what you said.

I never understand why people get quite so interested in odd stuff that has very limited if any buyers for when for the same money they could buy a real big red book listed variety coin like you said.

I was amazed in someones post that somebody said they sold a 55-S coin with some lamination defect for about what you can buy an MS65 red 72 die 1.

Did I read that right?
http://www.coppercoins.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1994&start=15

Makes me wonder if a "dealer" bought something like that they would be out of bussiness very quick with a shelf full of odd stuff nobody will buy.

[creilly]

That was mine!! The 55-S. Yup it was a coin dealer in the mall. I was hoping to get $10.00.
Apparently thats what he collects (lamination issues) and he was willing to pay that price. Unless there was something else to the coin that I missed! Which is very likely. Iwill say the lamination thing was really cool as the metal was still attached to the coin.
I found this quarter in change the other day.. At first I though acid or possibly soda but the back is ok.. doesnt look ran over or anything but who knows..... Its a very abrupt line under the scope. I tossed it in the interesting to look at bucket.

[eagames]

Cathy,
Sounds like you did a good job finding the right buyer for it!
I guess the key is to sell the right error to the person that likes that kind of error. Since I don't know people that collect most odd types of errors I think ebay is good since hopefully a few folks that like it might fight for it, I've seen more than a few strike errors on there go for crazy money

[creilly]

It was just dumb luck.

[coop]

On some older Cents you may see this on even BU coins. Sometimes it is light almost transparent in color. But I would guess it is grease from the striking if the coin was found in a BU OBW roll. But from circulation...... Who know for sure.

[Dick]

Cathy, that quarter looks like a few II have with partial plating missing, and in some cases, the whole face is minus the plating. I don't know what they are worth,. but they are "stashed" until.....
Dick

[Dick]

Coop, do you know when, and/or if the Memorial Building was modified to rid it of the
"extra columns? I have two older, (pre 1982), that have nearly a full column next to Abe. The 1999 don't show this feature.
Dick